tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6570809348314913884.post8328975297146575898..comments2009-10-08T23:10:31.857-04:00Comments on Summorum Pontificum: Cardinal Hoyos: Some not satisfied even after pope...Patrick Archboldhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13230114519933936165noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6570809348314913884.post-89918431431169964722008-09-23T13:21:00.000-04:002008-09-23T13:21:00.000-04:00Meantime, we are bound to be charitable, (which pr...<I>Meantime, we are bound to be charitable, (which prevents me from pistol-whipping certain prelates, but such self-denial may win a few days off Purgatory!)</I><BR/><BR/>Fortunately (if I understand it correctly) in the new Code of Canon, one only incurs a latae sententiae excommunication for striking the person of the Pope. It is no longer a latae sententiae excommunication for simply striking a priest, bishop, or cardinal (though there may be certain civil and criminal repercussions, which would have to be weighed against the merits of the pistol-whipping, tar-and-feathering, or other corporal works of mercy one might envision.)Brian Kopphttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02575906703463685178noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6570809348314913884.post-27809278350692427172008-09-22T16:12:00.000-04:002008-09-22T16:12:00.000-04:00Umnnnhhhh, yah.And you expect that the Bishops wil...Umnnnhhhh, yah.<BR/><BR/>And you expect that the Bishops will suddenly fall into line because they got a LETTER?<BR/><BR/>....or that the priests will be willing to commit the time and money to take the case into Canon Courts, (not to mention the niggling little 'troublemaker' mark they'll incur on their file)?<BR/><BR/>I think the Benedictine Revolution WILL occur, but it will play out in the same time-frame that the Bugnini Revolution did--about 50 years.<BR/><BR/>Meantime, we are bound to be charitable, (which prevents me from pistol-whipping certain prelates, but such self-denial may win a few days off Purgatory!)Dad29http://www.blogger.com/profile/08554276286736923821noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6570809348314913884.post-9369997562261092942008-09-19T09:47:00.000-04:002008-09-19T09:47:00.000-04:00"what would you have PCED do to 'recalcitrant Bish...<I>"what would you have PCED do to 'recalcitrant Bishops'?"</I><BR/><BR/>Simply send them a letter outlining the rights of the priests to offer the TLM without <B>any</B> interference from the local bishop, send the same letter to the priests involved, and encourage those priests to continue to prepare and then offer the TLM.<BR/><BR/>If there are any reprisals against the priests by aforesaid bishops, then let it be worked out in the canonical system. Of course, the priests in question would be permitted to continue to offer the TLM until the bishop(s) proves in canonical court why the priests should not offer the TLM.<BR/><BR/>And who is at the top of the canonical courts that would handle such cases? Archbishop Burke.<BR/><BR/>Game, set, and match.Brian Kopphttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02575906703463685178noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6570809348314913884.post-59192278103099489942008-09-18T16:11:00.000-04:002008-09-18T16:11:00.000-04:00Brian, what would you have PCED do to 'recalcitran...Brian, what would you have PCED do to 'recalcitrant Bishops'?<BR/><BR/>Flogging?<BR/><BR/>Public shaming?<BR/><BR/>You can read the book "Papal Legislation on Sacred Music" by Mgr. Hayburn, or take my word for it (I did read it...): disobedience to Rome is (practically) the fifth mark of the Church. <BR/><BR/>That may be irreverent, but it's true.Dad29http://www.blogger.com/profile/08554276286736923821noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6570809348314913884.post-79628714693534754042008-09-17T21:18:00.000-04:002008-09-17T21:18:00.000-04:00"There's a good deal of justification for the Card...<I>"There's a good deal of justification for the Cardinal's comments"</I><BR/><BR/>When the PCED has publicly dealt with the recalcitrant/intransigent/disobedient bishops who are preventing the implementation of Summorum Pontificum, then it might be time to publicly dress down those who are writing, desperately seeking relief from these bishops.<BR/><BR/>Until then, these comments are uncharitable at best. A man of Cardinal Hoyos' caliber and experience should be able to simply ignore the more outrageous letters and internet posts. <BR/><BR/>So who is he really attacking here?Brian Kopphttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02575906703463685178noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6570809348314913884.post-50630843966081051892008-09-17T16:04:00.000-04:002008-09-17T16:04:00.000-04:00meh...There's a good deal of justification for the...meh...<BR/><BR/>There's a good deal of justification for the Cardinal's comments, based on my conversations (over 20 years' duration) with EF adherents.<BR/><BR/>About 5-10% of them are simply unhappy with ANY liturgical arrangement. Yes, there is plenty to be cynical (or unhappy) about; but reality never seems to intrude on the minds of some.<BR/><BR/>As posted by D Alexander today (http://www.summorumpontificum.net/2008/09/advocatus-diaboli-supply-reconsidered.html) it's not just a matter of magic.<BR/><BR/>A lot of forces have to be assembled and deployed.<BR/><BR/>And IIRC, disobedience to authority has a long, long, history. One would think that if nothing else, EF adherents would at least understand history's lessons.Dad29http://www.blogger.com/profile/08554276286736923821noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6570809348314913884.post-31277180425894346742008-09-16T21:07:00.000-04:002008-09-16T21:07:00.000-04:00An old friend over at FreeRepublic made a pertinen...An old friend over at FreeRepublic made a pertinent comment on this article:<BR/><BR/><I>This story is a bit strange. There is a much bigger problem in the reception of Summorum Pontificum, and it is not from traditionalists.<BR/><BR/>There is still a de facto ban on the Extraordinary Form in most dioceses. Even when a priest knows how to offer this form of the Mass, he is often prevented from doing so through unlawful "tests" which bishops have imposed, or through simple intimidation.<BR/><BR/><B>There needs to be a lot more generosity on the part of bishops before I will believe that a few cranks who complain on blogs no one reads is some sort of crisis.</B></I>Brian Kopphttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02575906703463685178noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6570809348314913884.post-38762173613912774392008-09-16T20:36:00.000-04:002008-09-16T20:36:00.000-04:00Dan Hunter said..."Now we have Cardinal Castrillon...Dan Hunter said...<BR/><I>"Now we have Cardinal Castrillon Hoyos backtracking on what he earlier said, when he called for ALL parishes to offer the Gregorian Rite."</I><BR/><BR/>I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed this...Brian Kopphttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02575906703463685178noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6570809348314913884.post-61631101657261078332008-09-16T14:45:00.000-04:002008-09-16T14:45:00.000-04:00"Cardinal Castrillon, whose commission works with ..."Cardinal Castrillon, whose commission works with communities using the old rite, said his office continues to receive letters requesting the Tridentine rite be used not just at one Mass a week but at every Mass, and that such Masses be available not just at one church in a town but at every church"<BR/><BR/>Now we have Cardinal Castrillon Hoyos backtracking on what he earler said, when he called for ALL parishes to offer the Gregorian Rite.<BR/>And when O when is the document on the clarifications coming out?<BR/><BR/>The hierarchy can be very confusing sometimes.Dan Hunterhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14823464458933233001noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6570809348314913884.post-45125206405053843742008-09-16T14:16:00.000-04:002008-09-16T14:16:00.000-04:00Hey, it's certainly good to know that at least the...Hey, it's certainly good to know that at least the document is done, and is just waiting on the Pope to decide what to do next.<BR/><BR/>Time to grab those rosaries, folks.Jordaneshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17951083063448447552noreply@blogger.com